Hi, I'm rather new as a TPU member and have been looking over the forums and learning groups for the last few days. Although I'm glad to see so many programmers around my age in one place(I've hardly met two or three in the last year), I was a little disappointed by the lack of material on assembly language programming to be found on the website. It seems like most programmers have either little to no experience with assembly programming(enough to write a simple routine perhaps), or a comprehensive amount. I think this may be because assembly language is a bit more daunting to novice programmers than C++, Java, or other HLL's, making it sort of an all-or-nothing venture.

On to the point, I think it might be a good idea to try and stimulate interest in assembly language by creating a 80x86 assembly learning group. There is a huge amount of information on assembly language that we could link to, and I'd be happy to volunteer to coordinate the effort. By providing a support platform for those interested in learning assembly language we could help people develop their skills in parallel with their other interests. The experience would be a lot less confusing for many people.

I'm wondering how much interest this learning group would generate. I'm sure it wouldn't match up with the C++ LG in terms of members, but we might attract a few people.

Any comments?

It sounds like a good idea if there are enough people interested in it. It looks like we'll be switching from Learning Groups to Interest Groups soon, by the way.

I'm in: Perhaps one thing the learning group could do is write a brand spanking new tutorial: Assembly tutorials are hard to find.

You can check out some interest group stuff at:

http://test.tpu.org/tea/IG./cg-82

There's also the framed browsing stuff that buzgub's been working on!

Ill be learning assembly in school this semester and it scares the hell out of me

It's not that bad. It's just incredibly logical, you just have to think in more steps than you would programming in a HLL. Where you can do something in C in one line, you would need to break that down into as many little parts as possible, and decide the most efficient combination of instructions to make it happen.

I like the idea of writing a new assembly tutorial. The only really comprehensive free tutorial available is The Art of Assembly, which is a little to big to use. It also uses HLA which I don't think most people are interested in using. If anyone has an interest in helping to author the tutorial, please contact me.

With regards to that frames stuff,you can turn it on in your preferences in test.tpu.org and it should work - it should be finished. I haven't pulled it into www.tpu.org yet, because I'm not confident it works properly. So, please pummel it. If it breaks, please tell me (here, email or irc if I'm there).

Anyway, I think an assembly LG is a good idea. It is not unlikely that I would use it.

I may also, I think my "Programming Embeded Microcontrollers" class will be using assembly

Oooh, just reading Psion's dropped tidbit about Interest Groups reminded me that I used to run a TPU Interest Group for DJGPP. Wow that was a while ago. The URL was surf.to/djgppig and I was 13 or 14 when I designed the website --- my third or fourth if I remember correctly (the first was a showcase of my QBASIC programs when I was 12 EUCK!).

Sorry, but that was just a trip down nostalgia lane for me.

Codered, why program Microcontrollers in Assembly when so many useful compilers for high(er) level languages exist?

I rather program microcomputers with java.
You should make it, so that 'qbasic' censors out to 'qb*sic'.

Or, have it automatically change it to qbaSuck

I know a little x86 assembly, I wrote tron :) http://24.45.226.19:83/minitron.zip (I had a parner, but he didn't do much).

Tron as the protector of the other programs, or Tron as a light cycle game?

I assume the game, very easy to do, nibbles is one step higher as the tail must follow you, using a linked list is a good way to do it. Found out today I will programming in assebly for the Motorola 68HC12, sounds fun!

I'd love to program a Nokia. You can do it if you unsolder the EPROM chip in the back and you have to use one of them EPROM writers and do it in hex/Machine Code.

/me drools

rdd: Somehow I like the idea of writing programs to a hard drive better. :)

mop: light cycle, I just used regsistors to hold the direction and last pixel of each player and read from graphic memory (320x200 256 color) for collision. It still exits itself if you draw the game in just the right way though. I don't know why... other than I never wrote draw code.

Yeah, but a Nokia is cooler, besides you program on your hard drive(/me thinks) and then move it onto the chip. And when your done, you have to resolder the chip back in.

what is /me...?

"/me" is an IRC command that indicates action. For example if I typed "/me posts" you would see "*AnyoneEB posts" instead of "<AnyoneEB> posts"

If you're thinking of experimenting alot with that Nokia, you'll better get a EPROM-emulator. That is if you can get one hooked up to it. Last GSM I opend up contained 99% surface mount devices(the very small kind) and you can replace a SMD EPROM only so many times until the copper gets loose from the board.
Perhaps if you could replace the original EPROM with a IC socket?

Oh, I didn't know, /me stores valuable /me information in photographic memory.

Well, I don't know how to do it, so it doesn't matter.

is there any executable stuff on the sim cards? that would make it a bit easier... (i don't have any idea about how mobile phones work, so...)

The SIM-card probably contains just (encrypted) numbers and memory space for phone numbers and other cellphone stuff.
There are card simular to the SIM-card (or any chip card) that contain a PIC ?processor.

I know theres a EPROM chip in there. I can't find where I read it but I know its somewhere in http://mobile.box.sk.

That would be fun stuff, well, doing it for handheld devices not including cell phones would be better. I really want to learn more about that.

/me wants a zaurus

/me wants a top-of-the-range Nokia.

The only problem is I don't know who'd I'd talk to with a phone.

Then buy 2 phones and talk to yourself? :-)

I want Sharp to release an update Zaurus with more flash ROM. Then I'll get one and have a PDA running 100% Free Software (using the OpenZaurus image).