I'm sort of new to programming. Well, actual programming i'm pretty much a virgin, i haven't really programmed in my life. But, I have been scripting JavaScript for a while now, and I am getting a broader knowledge of CSS. But i would like to know where i could start with C++, should i just go and get one of those "C++ for Dummies" books? Please give me some guidance. Thanks :) Sam

If I were you I definately wouldn't start with a Dummies book. If I were you I would go to www.informit.com and use the books on their free library for a while. The Learn C++ in 21 Days isn't the best book, but it's free and is a good start. After you have read that I would move on to www.bruceeckel.com and read Thinking in C++, also free. Actually, try to use the two in conjunction, although the latter might be a bit harder. You can also surf the web for tutorials. Hope this helps!

And please don't post messages to multiple forums in the future.

Sorry nid -- I have to completely disagree -- You DON NOT learning programming by reading a book, you learn programming by programming -- The books out there are friggn' ridiculous and not practical for what's used in the real world -- Are they good syntax references? Absolutely, but that means you already have to know the syntax!!!!!!

That's why www.GameTutorials.com was created ý We have plenty of tutorials in C++ (That is source code that compiles in to a program with EXTENSIVE commenting that explains step by step EVERY LINE OF CODE)

I'd be lying if I didn't strongly feel this is the BEST place to learn C++ -- GameDev just recently decided to host us, so if you worried about credibility I think GameDev speaks for itself.

Good luck --

It's cute and all how you whore your website nearly every time you post, and, since it's free now, I can't decide whether it's because you have some strange irrational hatred of books, or something far more sinister. Books are very nice. They are much more than 'syntax references'. The original post was pretty much about learning the language. Not learning how to do specific things with the language. So no, the suggestion about using books (albeit free, online books) is much more appropriate. 'Thinking in C++' is quite a bit more than a syntax reference, plus it's free online. Nifty.

No I don't hate books -- It's just they don't TEACH you programming -- Programming teaches you programming -- Reading a book on auto repairs DOES NOT make ya a mechanic ý

That logic sounds familiar from another thread.... ;-P

- taubz

Well it's true -- To give another example, I can read all the books I want to on playing baseball -- But that doesn't make me a baseball player -- My problem with the programming books is that the people I talk too think if they buy a book and read it, they're all of a sudden a programmer -- This is the FARTHEST thing from the truth. Plus once a book is released, chances are itýs severally outdated ý For instance the new version of Visual Studio 7 completely changes the way VB programming is done ý It is NOTHING like the old way (itýs much more object oriented and like real programming now, sorry VB guys :)

If you TRULY want to learn programming, you should start making simple apps (starting with "Hello World"). Be prepared to sit in front of your computer for hours (if not days) trying to figure out stupid little errors. But once you've figured out one of those stupid little errors, chances are you'll never make that same mistake ý Programming, like every skill, requires practice -- So spend your time practicing not reading :)

/me slaps TheTutor with TAOCP.

But seriously. Of course practice makes perfect. But your baseball analogy is silly. Playing baseball is much less of a mental process than a physical one. So, even if I read for years about baseball, if I have no legs, it doesn't help me be a good baseball player. Programming, on the other hand, relies nearly completely on mental activity. So while reading a book on programming won't actually serve as a substitute for actually doing stuff, it's not time wasted, if the book is a good one. And your first reason for disliking books is also quite silly. It's like hating cars because there are bad drivers. Your problem isn't really with the cars, just the bad drivers. Oh well. And lots of books stay relevant.

You obviously don't play sports or you'd know they require just as much mental effort as physical -- Again I never said I dislike books ("The Shining" is a great book) -- But for LEARNING programming, NO BOOK is a substitute for SITTING DOWN AT THE COMPUTER AND PHYSICALLY TYPING IN CODE AND COMPILING it -- Books should only be used as a supplement, not the main course when appeasing your appetite for programming knowledge.

And the baseball analogy makes perfect sense -- First of all programming is physically draining (ever stay up all night to meet a deadline?) -- But besides that, "thinking" is physically draining. ý But if you want to differentiate physical from mental activities, reading a book on accounting DOESNýT make you an accountant.

Are you serious about the books staying relevant? Buying a programming book is no different than buying a new computer. By the time you unpack it, there will be something newer/better/different out.

It's not the same kind of mental effort. And when 'staying up all night to meet a deadline', it's not the activity that's draining, so much as the fact that you're staying up all night. How it is that reading a book on accounting doesn't make you an accountant, if it contained all the relevant information, and you were able to reatin it?

The way baseball is different is, assuming we have two sets of books, one on programming, and one on baseball, and a person capable of understanding both exactly, retaining all information therein.

Said person could read the baseball books, and still be unable to make a very good baseball player, even if he understood everything. However, the programming books are nothing but understanding the material. So, it's quite different.

Lots of books stay relevant. If one is just learning the principles of a language, then the age of a book is not so relevant. The C Programming language is as relevant today, as when it was published first although it has been modified to conform to some ANSI C specification, iirc. The books that won't stay relevant are those that deal with emerging technologies that are in constant flux. Sure, a book on MS-WhizBang might be outdated because MS-WhizBangII gets released next year, but, those types of books are more about specific technologies, and not about general principles, or core language features.

At first it seemed like your aversion to books on 'programming' was because you wanted to promote your own site and its special tutorials. But now I guess it's just due to brain damage =]. Oh well, to each his own!

Here's where you 'n me differ -- I'm saying that reading a programming book, and retaining the information doesn't really mean anything -- Just because I can recite all the Win32 API's and know what parameters they take doesn't do me any good if I don't know when I should be calling them in my application. Programming is about problem solving, a skill, that just like playing baseball can be refined through practice --

About C, it's like totally 90's -- Everything is going C++/Java -- And Java might get the heave hoe since XP doesn't support it -- At first I thought you were so pro book 'cause perhaps you wrote one, now I see you are too pubescent for such a task :)

Well, a good book isn't just a list of API functions, their pre and post conditions, and paramaters. It's how and why you use it. As for having written a book, well, kinda. For my CS class this past year, my task was to write a chapter for the textbook my CS teacher was/is writing for cs at my school. Does that count? If it does, yes!

As for everything going C++/java, I guess. Where I work, an engineering firm, all of their software is written in C, running on DOS. Now they're starting to move to Windows/C++. But that's still a bit away, lots of stuff there is still C. As for Java, did windows ever have a _good_, current vm/library? Not really. 'Sides, where java shines in serverside, not client, where the environment is more readily customizable.

Hey that's cool you "wrote a book" -- Hope you get big royalties :)

No, I did learn a lot though.

Well, there is a third party solution,
I just bought a four page introductory brocure, read it over, made a program, and then took *dramatic music* A Class! *Gasp!* That's right, I actualy popped the extra few bucks to get someone who could go in and show me the semicolon I had dropped out on line 27899, insted of me comparing to the book (or heavily commented demo source) charicter for charicter and then delving into the assembler before giving up and killing myself.

And so it was a computer lost, all for the want of a semicolon.