I'd like to start a discussion of how everyone sees his ideal vision of TPU, and then how to go about making them real. :-)

As I've said before, my vision of TPU is as more of a community tool to bring people of like interests together than yet another programming reference site. Thinking about the web site, I think the organization would most benefit from keeping a community flavor, and the emphasis on people instead of shiny technology. I know I've been guilty of just organizing the web site around dynamic content and capabilities before, and possibly now, too. :-) Lately, I'm thinking that, instead of the main page just listing out dynamic items and providing links off into subsections, it should keep the things that are there now, but also have the most important links, longer descriptions of other resources like IRC and the mailing list, and general text to acquaint new members with how they can use TPU to become better programmers and meet others.

We've had some suggestions on ways that TPU can be the best resource possible. The learning projects idea seems to be floundering, partly, I think, due to the fact that it was so ill-defined. Someone suggested a guided group learning of languages program, which sounds like it might work out much better. Please post any suggestions of how you think such a thing could be run, because I think it could really help people who want to learn new languages/tools/etc., but don't know how to get started.

Another suggestion that received some interest was providing shells for members. If several people were willing to allow shells on their computers, and install an agreed upon standard set of development tools in standard places, we could possibly get something pretty nifty and useful going. Maybe we could even have a shared file system between all such machines. Any thoughts?

One thing I'd personally like to see is some way that TPU can help to increase acceptance of individual hobbyist training, the sort of way that most of us have learned programming, to employers. Along this line, the jobs posting board was sort of a nice idea, though unused. I think it might be more useful for TPU members to post about job opportunities that they know, instead of having the employers post the info. In general, I'm interested in how TPU can help members get the sorts of normal jobs that they want, so I'd like to see what you all have to say about that.

Please add any ideas that you have for improving TPU to this discussion!

After leading a learning project, it certainly seems that we have quite a few members that are interested in learning programming and advanced (especially games) programming. Unfortunately, I believe that the learning groups system will ultimately flop, for a number of reasons:
1) Not enough work for each individual person to do some (no one would know exactly what they needed to do, or else their part would be incredibly small; some parts would end up relying on others, ie a huge mess would ensue).
2) Every person at a different skill level.
3) Hard to "teach" and expect someone to create quality code at the same time.
4) Lack of volunteers in some sections.
5) Difficulty in subdividing work.
6) Impossible to teach everything about the area to accommodate everyone's knowledge.
7) Inability of everyone to meet in regular IRC meetings.
8) Lack of many people posting and shareing their ideas!!!
9) Lack of common compiler/development software.
10) Stubborness or inability of members to switch or obtain dev software.
11) No pressure to turn work in on time/promotes procrastination.
12) and so on...

If everyone were to be in the same place as a class or something, then it might work; however, with everyone across the world, etc. it just becomes a nightmare to manage - and when no one even posts their opinions on issues it becomes a horrible situation! That is what we really need - everyone to post - then it will work!

Anyway, enough on this issue ... I think it may be beneficial to set-up a peer training program instead of a group one, where a member who wants to acquire a new programming skill is placed with another who knows the skill and who is willing to guide them or teach them, whichever is needed. The mentor, as he wishes, could give projects, exercises, or just instruction, or maybe even the two could just work on a simple project together in the area! I think that would work a little better.

As far as shells go, it may work for *some* people ... most, I would imagine, would not go for it. It's just a lot easier to have the dev software on your own computer ... we could use DJGPP or something. A shared file system, however, is an excellent idea.

We also need an advertising campaign to get new members ... there are lots of people out there who would be perfect for TPU, but don't know anything about it.

Mike [mnansgar@hotmail.com]

Advertising is definitely a big need. Anyone have any great ideas of how to get it, preferably for free?

http://www-test.waikato.ac.nz/library/resources/edu/technology.shtml

I got that included, the site doesn't go live for a while, but Library websites are a good start. I'm willing to try and premote to high school programming classes etc.

I dunno about advertising. When those "learning" projects started up, a lot of new faces appeared out of nowhere. Psion, do you know how many new accounts there are daily/weekly?

I guess here's my vision (yes, here comes the evangicalist preacher). I like the format of the site, and I have since the time of Gaz's old site. The links to the subsections are probably never used because you don't know what's inside, and there isn't much. I don't really think we need those categories. Instead, maybe we should take the links and put them all into quick start guides all listed on the main page.

The learning projects I still think were one of the best ideas ever posted. I don't have time to really work on them, but my suggestion would be to start with something a lot less ambitious. A useless console app that computes the value of various polynomials sorted by degree and such. No room for much creativity on the part of the participants. They can all work on the same code together, so things don't need to be modular. Higher skilled people can do more watching and guiding while lower skilled people would be encouraged to actually make the whole program from start to finish. It could still be fun.

Mike, the peer training program is also a great idea. Though, I think the message boards allow people to instantly pair up with any number of people. Maybe instead individuals like us could sponsor certain projects that novices would do on their own to learn certain things, but would come to us if they had problems. Sort of like group learning projects, but individual...

I'm still trying to figure out a way to get a server for shell accounts going. Dunno quite what to do yet. A router would help... I probably could set up a box behind my cable modem with IP masquerading or something like that for the other computers.

- taubz

The people showed up because I advertised on gamedev.net. Finding more places to advertise that are such gold mines for drawing people would be great! It would be good to have an idea of what we would be doing differently so things worked out better this time.

Heres the thing that I have noticed. When we started the learning "projects" there was a ton of messages etc... Once the heat died down no one really cared enough to do jack. Plus people were way to ambitious. Starting from the ground up is the way to go on this one. I think that the master programmers around here don't really feel like mentoring either (although many of you will probably give me a talkin to about that). Anywho I thought it was all great but horribly organized.
BTW I like the bulletin boards just the way they are I hate UBB!!! But thats just me.